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Post by bluepikmin11 on Jan 22, 2015 1:25:52 GMT
Tank Fill definitely sounds like one of the funnest modes I could possibly play.
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Post by philmaster227 on Jan 22, 2015 2:15:47 GMT
I now think that Splatoon should and I'm fairly confident will have a tournament mode online in-part of the multiplayer. How awesome would it be to set up 16 teams of 4 players (64 players total) and play with specific rules set by the tournament creator. Rules could include allowed modes, maps, weapons, clothing, tournament times and so on. This would be amazing!
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smittythesquid
Inkster Jr.
Can't wait until May, the Splatoon hype is so friggin real!!
Posts: 26
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Post by smittythesquid on Jan 22, 2015 2:21:22 GMT
I now think that Splatoon should and I'm fairly confident will have a tournament mode online in-part of the multiplayer. How awesome would it be to set up 16 teams of 4 players (64 players total) and play with specific rules set by the tournament creator. Rules could include allowed modes, maps, weapons, clothing, tournament times and so on. This would be amazing! That would be pretty awesome! I would love playing in these tournaments. I also think it has a good chance of being implemented into the game, or something very similar.
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Post by TrojanSquid711 on Jan 22, 2015 2:48:27 GMT
Here's a couple of game mode ideas. Tank FillYou have an empty tankard in the middle of the map that you need to fill up with ink. You do so by spraying the tankard with ink, and once it's filled up 100%, the team with the most ink in the tankard will win the match. WOAH... THAT SOUNDS AWESOME!!! Very cool. I can see there being some conflict with what you do. Do you splat enemies and stop them while wasting time yourself? Or do you ignore them and gun for the tankard? Only problem I see with this is that Melee weapons would be useless unless the tankard has an area on it just for them. I think for Melee weapons, attacking it directly with them will still fill them up (why? Nintendo logic, I guess \O.o/), but at a slower rate than non-Melee weapons so no one's really hugging the tankard.
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Post by TheBlackbird on Jan 22, 2015 3:03:22 GMT
Tank Fill sounds rather clever. I'd play it.
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smittythesquid
Inkster Jr.
Can't wait until May, the Splatoon hype is so friggin real!!
Posts: 26
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Post by smittythesquid on Jan 22, 2015 3:05:42 GMT
I would definitely play Tank Fill, sounds simple but incredibly fun at the same time.
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Post by philmaster227 on Jan 22, 2015 12:56:50 GMT
Tank fill almost sounds like an official game mode now! It would be fantastic if something close to this is in the game.
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Xeiros
Inkling Admiral
Posts: 253
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Post by Xeiros on Jan 23, 2015 0:42:47 GMT
Tank Fill sounds pretty awful when I actually think about it.
1. So we've got a single point on the map that actually matters. We've gone from the entire map's surface area being important to barely a fraction of it. This basically destroys any sense of map strategy as it has essentially become irrelevant. The Tank is all that matters.
2. Super Weapons become less useful. In order to gain access to one you must paint the ground with ink. This not only wastes time you could be spending filling up the tank, many of them are more useful as burst damage or spreading ink on a surface than actual IPS. Don't even get me started on Ink barrier.
3. Many secondary weapons become useless as well. Examples like the Ink Wall and Ink Sprinkler which shine for their ability to help control key paths on the map become worthless when all you're meant to do is shoot ink into the tank as quickly as possible. They certainly won't help you with that especially given the amount of ink they cost to use.
4. The Squid form outside of the first initial push to reach the Tank itself and this even assuming it's not just a tiny area with the Tank right in front of both teams when it starts becomes far less useful. It's your quickest movement option to a specific point, but only when another superior method has been ruled out. All the value, thrill and fun of swimming along the ground, up walls, and leaping over objects as a squid goes flying out the window. At least assuming you want to help your team win.
If this imagined mode is indeed just a tiny arena with a large tank in the middle, the form is essentially worthless. As the more time you spend swimming around it as a squid, the less time you'll spend actually filling the tank. Should we assume it's a large tank placed in the middle of one the maps we've already seen then then as long as at least one teammate is at the tank, the Super Jump becomes the superior return option after you've been splattered.
It's pretty important to keep the main game mechanics consistent between modes. Right now we only know of the one, but it's vital not to constantly change the rules so to speak which is why I'm going off on the assumption that the they'll remain the same regardless of what the actual goal of the mode is. Tank fill takes many of the options you'd normally have and either makes them outright useless or far less useful than just plain firing your main weapon/ducking into your ink to refill and repeating. That's a recipe for tired, boring, and lifeless gameplay in the long run. They all mattered in Turf War, but in this mode they fall flat.
You're only real choices assuming actually reaching the tank itself is not an issue are: 1. Shoot at the tank a bunch. 2. Try to splatter the other players so they can't shoot at the tank a bunch 3. Try not to get splattered while also trying to shoot at the tank a bunch. 4. Forget about the tank entirely and just try to splatter each other. You'd probably have more fun fighting others players as you try to splatter one another than actually filling the tank which is you know the primary objective. That's a bad sign.
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Post by philmaster227 on Jan 23, 2015 1:26:37 GMT
Tank Fill sounds pretty awful when I actually think about it. 1. So we've got a single point on the map that actually matters. We've gone from the entire map's surface area being important to barely a fraction of it. This essentially destroys any sense of map strategy as it has essentially become irreverent. The Tank is all that matters. 2. Super Weapons become less useful. In order to gain access to one you must paint the ground with ink. This not only wastes time you could be spending filling up the tank, many of them are more useful as burst damage than actual IPS. Don't even get me started on Ink barrier. 3. Many secondary weapons become useless as well. Examples like the Ink Wall and Ink Sprinkler which shine for their ability to help control key paths on the map become worthless when all you do is shot ink into the tank quickly as possible. They certainly won't help you with that especially given the amount of ink they cost to use. 4. The Squid form outside of the first initial push to reach the Tank itself and this even assuming it's not just a tiny area with the Tank right in front of both teams when it starts becomes far less useful. It's your quickest movement option to a specific point, but only when another superior method has been ruled out. All the value, thrill and fun of swimming along the ground, up walls, and leaping over objects as a squid goes flying out the window. At least assuming you want to help your team win. If this imagined mode is indeed just a tiny arena with a large tank in the middle, the form is essentially worthless. As the more time you spend swimming around it as a squid, the less time you'll spend actually filling the tank. Should we assume it's a large tank placed in the middle of one the maps we've already seen then then as long as at least one teammate is at the tank, the Super Jump becomes the superior return option after you've been splattered. It's pretty important to keep the main game mechanics consistent between modes. Right now we only know of the one, but it's vital not to constantly change the rules so to speak which is why I'm going off on the assumption that the they'll remain the same regardless of what the actual goal of the mode is. Tank fill takes many of the options you'd normally have and either makes them outright useless or far less useful than just plain firing your main weapon/ducking into your ink to refill and repeating. That's a recipe for tired, boring, and lifeless gameplay in the long run. They all mattered in Turf War, but in this mode they fall flat. You're only real choices are assuming actually reaching the tank itself is not an are: 1. Shoot at the tank a bunch. 2. Try to splatter the other players so they can't shoot at the tank a bunch 3. Try not to get splattered while also trying to shoot at the tank a bunch. 4. Forget about the tank entirely and just try to splatter each other. You'd probably have more fun fighting others players as you try to splatter one another than actually filling the tank which is you know the primary objective. That's a bad sign. You actually bring up very valid points. I agree, I don't want the rules of Splatoon to be changed in between game modes. So maybe all new modes will be based around having the map covered in ink, then with some add on to make it a different game mode.
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Post by Bleak Forest on Jan 23, 2015 6:58:54 GMT
The last thing this game needs is to try and cash in on the overdone zombie cliche. I'm sick of it. An admittedly small part of this game's appeal to me is that it's as far from that as you could possibly get while still being a shooter. It's easy to simply reuses the same tired game modes from other games, but I'd be thrilled to see something new or if we do just get rehashes they're done in a way that fit this game style and aesthetic rather than a lazy cut and paste. A lot of factors go into making certain modes work well in a balanced engaging manner. I think maybe a sort of Splatoon version of TF2's Man vs. Machine might make sense as a Co-op PvE mode. Beyond that, I think using the octopi in some mode would be smart as to make more use of the games assets.
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Post by philmaster227 on Jan 23, 2015 12:13:16 GMT
The last thing this game needs is to try and cash in on the overdone zombie cliche. I'm sick of it. An admittedly small part of this game's appeal to me is that it's as far from that as you could possibly get while still being a shooter. It's easy to simply reuses the same tired game modes from other games, but I'd be thrilled to see something new or if we do just get rehashes they're done in a way that fit this game style and aesthetic rather than a lazy cut and paste. A lot of factors go into making certain modes work well in a balanced engaging manner. I think maybe a sort of Splatoon version of TF2's Man vs. Machine might make sense as a Co-op PvE mode. Beyond that, I think using the octopi in some mode would be smart as to make more use of the games assets. I was thinking more like a Modern warfare 3 survival mode with the octopus being the enemies and there is a 4 player co-op mode!
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hawk
Full Squid
a.k.a. Hock
Posts: 53
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Post by hawk on Jan 23, 2015 14:48:58 GMT
Ok, considering what Xeiros said, what about this version of "tank fill" I just made up?: -A tank or target appears on the map, it takes very little time to fill it, or even just a single accurate shot. -Inking this target gives your team 1 point. -Every time you shoot a target it desappears, and another one appears on a different point of the map. -Every 2 minutes an additional target appears, increasing the total number of targets on the map at the same time. -The match ends after 5 minutes. -The team with more points at the end wins.
This way controlling territory does have an effect, because the new target might appear anywhere, this also forces people to move all around the map. Splattering enemies might be useful in order to prevent them reaching the target before you, but it's not the main objective. You won't spend most of the time just shooting an unmoving tank. Having more targets appear after time makes the team split and/or make decisions like abandoning one target to secure other. Having more targets at the last minute gives the losing team a chance to even out the score, and the action might be more frantic.
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Xeiros
Inkling Admiral
Posts: 253
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Post by Xeiros on Jan 23, 2015 17:23:08 GMT
Any game type that takes territory control over any ground surface area on the map only to narrow it down to specific points just feels like a watered down variation of the original. No, the new target cannot appear just anywhere; rather, It would appear randomly at one (or more depending on the time reaming) of a number of predetermined locations. We can't have a tank spawning instead a wall or other solid object for example. It's essentially become a variation on the King of the Hill game-type, but in many ways that's already what Turf Wars is. Your version of Tank fill simply increases the number of Tanks from just the one, but that's still less engaging because your making only specific points on the map important rather than the entire thing.
Then you have your odd point system. Since a match lasts exactly 5 minutes with additional simultaneous targets appearing every two minutes both teams will know they'll appear exactly at the 2 and 4 minute marks respectively every match. By memorizing all the possible locations you'd simply focus on securing the areas that actually matter ahead of time. Because IPS no longer matters given only a single accurate shot is necessary to fill a tank to gain a point, the Ink Rifle becomes far and away the best weapon to use since it allows you to fill tanks from far way without needing to spend the time swimming all the way over to them. Making other weapons useless by comparison is bad for balance. Melee and mid range weapons need not apply.
Again a lot of main weapons, sub weapons, and super weapons offer a wide array of functionality in Turf War. That's why it's important to consider if they'll still be just as useful in different scenarios. From spreading lots of ink, to temporarily blocking paths, to taking on three inklings at once with a barrier for protection. All become much less useful in your version of Tank Fill. I'd only need to be close enough to pop out, snipe the target, and quickly swim away. No need to fight anyone. No need to cover the ground in my teams ink as that isn't the main objective. I'd only require just enough ink (think splatter hopping) to reach any point on the outer edge of my range. Blocking paths would do nothing as I could shoot it from any conceivable angle.
It encourages a specific play-style while discouraging pretty much all others if you want to win. A dominant strategy if you will. Coming up with new game modes certainly isn't easy when you start to think about actually implementing them. How the various game mechanics would work with them and whether or not the various options available to you from a customization standpoint all matter are important factors to consider. That's why it's easy to see a version of CTF working just fine as ink map control, splatters, and team support weapons would all matter equally if you wanted to bring the flag all the way back to base in one piece.
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hawk
Full Squid
a.k.a. Hock
Posts: 53
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Post by hawk on Jan 24, 2015 1:37:23 GMT
Yeah, I know I'm not going to suddenly discover something better than turf wars or CTF, but I don't understand why you say that the target cannot appear anywhere, and that it must be narrowed down to a few predetermined locations. As long as its a point low enough for melee weapons to reach and not unfairly close to a team's spawn point, then everything goes. So holding a few positions would not really help that much. It sounds crazy, but I think we do have the tecnology to make them appear at random positions xDD Again, I'm not a game designer, and it's really hard to come up with a brand new game mode when the game is clearly not built around it. So I know its not the best idea ever, and of course not worth being included in the actual game, but it might be some fun, am I the only one who thinks so?
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Xeiros
Inkling Admiral
Posts: 253
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Post by Xeiros on Jan 24, 2015 2:20:15 GMT
Which do you think is easier and less time consuming? Making a predetermined set of locations in which it is safe for a tank to spawn or making a predetermined set of locations wherein a tank cannot spawn? Even if we ignored factors like map geometry, how do you make every weapon's (including secondary and special) usefulness shine equally without alienating others? In a game where all you're doing is trying to hit stationary targets as they spawn on the map, long ranged weapons of which Splatoon only has the Rifle class are far and away the best choice.
When you think about it, because all your doing is trying to shoot things, it would actually be more engaging to just play a Team/FFA Splatter mode because at least then map control matters and more importantly your "targets" can move and fight back. Since the game is so focused on the territory control aspect of the only game-type we know about, it feels like all other suggestions fall flat, but then again it's meant to be the main draw. It makes me wonder which direction they'll take with the other modes. Turf Wars appeals to me from a gameplay standpoint precisely because is isn't just another shooter with the same overdone mechanics. Taking some old and doing something new with it.
I suppose that's the biggest point of contention for me. Whether or not whatever the additional game modes are will be enough to make the game a complete 60 dollar worthy package. I don't want a bunch of tacked on half-assed extra modes just so we can say oh at least they're there. Turf Wars is so creative the others had better have just as much thought and effort put into them. Quality over Quantity if you will. That's why I mentioned earlier about stressing the importance and value of making each additional game-type a unique, fresh, and fun experience you can only get playing Splatoon.
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